Dizzee Rascal
When Dylan Mills released his debut album as Dizzee Rascal in 2003, he put London’s newest sound, grime, on the global map. Fashioned from his experiences as an amateur pirate radio DJ and MC as well as his fascination with Three 6 Mafia, drum & bass and heavy metal, Boy in da Corner captured the raw energy and determination of a teenager who had found salvation in music.
A critical and commercial success, the album earned Mills three Top 30 hits and the Mercury Prize at age 19. It also put him on the road to becoming the first legitimate pop star to emerge from the grime scene, with more albums, worldwide tours and a performance at the opening ceremony of the 2012 London Olympics.
As part of the 2016 Red Bull Music Academy UK Tour, Dizzee Rascal sat down for a public conversation in which he recalled the inspirations that went into his debut and the lessons learned along the way.
Hosted by Duane Jones You said this is nuts. You’re used to bigger audiences than this. Dizzee Rascal No, but this is different though, innit? Duane Jones Intimate. Dizzee Rascal Yeah. It’s good, though. It’s good. Duane Jones All good. Dizzee Rascal Thanks for coming as well man, you just showed me that people give a shit. I want to try and answer all your questions. Duane Jones Of course, man. You’re a national treasure, bro. Dizzee Rascal Live twitter ting like, innit? Duane Jones I hear you. I hear you. All right bro, so obviously you’re incredibly talented. Everyone knows that. Saw you smile there, good, good, good. I want to take it back to back in the day. Before we talk about the Boy in da Corner album, I want to take it to back in the day, and I want to know where you first discovered how talented you was. What was your first intro to music and you discovering exactly how talented you was? Dizzee Rascal Probably DJing. Duane Jones OK. Dizzee Rascal Drum & bass records. Anyone knows DJ Target? I used to buy records off him because he lived down the road on my estate. I used to buy records from him, just trying to mix. I wanted to be a big jungle DJ. I was like 14, 15, so it didn’t really kick off. You know, you got the bedroom setup, just MCing... Having the MCs around the setup and I’ll jump on the mic sometimes just because. But really I was just a DJ. From there I was doing pirate radio, I was DJing, then I started MCing properly, then in school, that’s when I started making beats. It was somewhere around then. Duane Jones What was you using to make beats? Dizzee Rascal Cubase. Anyone know of Cubase? Yeah, exactly, school ones. I remember Music 2000 on PlayStation, anyone remember that? That was like the first FruityLoops kind of thing. You could just put the shit together, make it sound good. Duane Jones OK. OK. I remember the first time hearing you on pirate radio. I want you to take us back to pirate radio, and how important that was for you, and how it felt to be on pirate radio. How influential was that in you becoming Dizzee Rascal? Dizzee Rascal That was everything to me, because at one point, that’s all I wanted, because you had things like Deja Vu, Rinse FM. I was lucky, they were all kind of local. That was around me, so I used to listen to the sets. I used to listen to Karnage, Geeneus, all the jungle DJs and that. I used to ring up live call-ins and all that. I remember that, and I just wanted to just DJ so bad. But when I finally got on there, I remember... What was the set? There was one radio station that someone started up, round near Bow church. A couple of my bredrens who were just in my local area, we went up there, we used to do a set. Then eventually I got on, I did a graveyard shift on Rinse FM, for like one till three in the morning and then went to school. This was when I was 15, or whatever. But that’s how much it meant to me, to even just be on the station. I just knew that Geeneus didn’t really like me then. That’s when I was a bit of a lil’ shit, he used to see me on the estate. But I managed to get on there, like I said, just as a DJ. Then when I fully, really wanted to get into MCing... It really started with the youth clubs, because you’d have to sit up there and you’d MC in front of everyone. But then eventually, I went on Flava FM. That’s where I know Kano and all dem, from young. And then Rinse FM, Deja Vu. Heat FM was the one that was on a strong note, it was the one that was in North London, over in Tottenham. I used to go over there with Ruff Sqwad and all that. I use to bump into all sorts of people over there, but that’s the one, they gave me a proper shot. Heat FM and Flava FM. Rinse FM and Deja kind of came later, but that’s when I started really becoming Dizzee Rascal and people started to know who I was and that. [points to mic] It’s a bit of feedback on this, innit? Duane Jones Yeah, little bit. Little bit. Turn the mics down slightly please. Alright, cool. Dizzee Rascal, that’s the name that really stood out. I think a lot of people, even before they heard you spit, or heard any of your music, were taken aback by that name. Where did you get the name “Dizzee Rascal”? Dizzee Rascal I was called Dizzee, I don’t know why. I just did it. I said I liked Dizzee, I don’t know why, I just said, “Dizzee.” There was another dude called Dizzee, [points to audience] you reminded me of him. His twin over there, your brother reminded me. There was another dude called Dizzee, this, like I said, was when I was DJing. We had to clash for the name. I remember, he was from Poplar, it was a big deal. I won though! [laughs] I remember that, and I kept the name, so then I was Dizzee. Must have been when I started my first secondary school. It’s called Blessed John Roche, in Poplar. I was in year seven and I remember the teacher said, “Oh, you’re such a rascal.” He said something like that. Then I changed my name to Rascal, and then obviously people were still calling me Dizzee, so I just put the two together and that was it. Duane Jones OK, OK. Coming from East London, the birthplace of grime, did you enjoy the competitiveness at that time in pirate radio? Is that something that you look back on, and you miss? Do you like that side of grime? Dizzee Rascal We’re talking like early, early. It was something that took us to other areas. Like I said, everything was segregated. If you’re from Bow, you were from Bow. If you were from Hackney, you were from Hackney. If you were Plaistow, you were from Plaistow. All those things, like with the different boroughs and that, but I might go to a youth club, because they had a setup. That’s where I know people like Kano and all that, or Ghetts. Ghetts was Reggie back then. This is the early, early, this is before me and Roll Deep, before all of that. So we go there... Or I might be in the youth club in Deptford, and that’s where I know whoever, Big Narstie from his younger cousin. Like I said, this was when I’m, like, young. There was a competitiveness then, but it was almost like... For me it was a necessity. I just wanted to do this so bad, but it was cool, it was fun. I’m glad that I know all of this people. There’s so much people that I might not be associated publicly with, because I kind of keep a low profile now, but I know I’m cool with so many people. There’s so many MCs, so many of your favorite MCs that I came up with, like way before I was on telly, way before all of that. That’s what’s good about it. That’s what come out of it. We all come from grassroots, you know what I mean? Duane Jones OK, so the Boy in da Corner album, obviously no one had heard anything that sounded like that. Still, to this day. I think that’s a proper unique sound man. What music was you listening to at that time, that influenced you to make an album of that sound? Dizzee Rascal Drum & bass, always. That’s my roots. When people talk about my roots, that’s my roots, jungle. Duane Jones Who from the jungle world really kind of influenced... Dizzee Rascal Trend and Target. Again, because they were local, but when they had tunes like “2 Degrees” and “Tune Your Bass,” and all these tunes, and whoever. Shy FX. I guess anyone who was big in drum & bass at the time, whether it was DJ Hype or people like Twisted Individual, Dillinja. Just all that shit. The whole era between ’95 and ’99 or something like that. Then garage came along. I was listening to garage. I started DJing garage, but I didn’t have the money to keep up with the record buying. What really happened was drum & bass was really kind of dying out, it wasn’t in the forefront as much. Garage came to the forefront. So then I had old jungle records. I wasn’t keeping up to date, because Target gave me all his records when he quit. But then, buying new records, that cost money, and I didn’t keep up with it. I think that was when I was starting really MCing more as well, and kind of letting go of the DJ side of things. What else? Even before all that I was into grunge. I love Nirvana, I love whoever. Guns N’ Roses, I know that's hard rock. Metallica, Iron Maiden, Korn. Duane Jones Wow. Dizzee Rascal I was into all that shit, yeah. You have to think about what we was spitting to on the radio as well. This is when garage got a bit darker. When Wookie started coming in with them basslines and Narrows. Early dubstep. When dubstep was sublow. Even though I was making my beats around that time, dem guys were still already established. Whatever Slimzee was playing on those sets, when Rinse FM was in Dagenham. The music was a bit weird, no one really knew what to call it. It was pre-grime, pre-dubstep, pre-all of that. Obviously I was into that. Duane Jones A lot of people obviously looking forward to the... Dizzee Rascal And R&B obviously. Duane Jones R&B? Dizzee Rascal Obviously, yeah. Definitely. Big. Big. Duane Jones For the ladies. Dizzee Rascal Of course. Duane Jones OK. Dizzee Rascal It was the tempo as well, so that added influence. The smoothness, the way the shit used to interlock and all that. Duane Jones But in terms of being smooth for the ladies, you wasn’t quite smooth for the ladies on Boy in da Corner [laughs]. What was you going through? Was you in a relation... Dizzee Rascal Do you know what it was, yeah? I’m not like a proper classically trained musician. I couldn’t sit there and read music if you put it in front of me. I still couldn’t to this day, but I used to do my kind of rendition of the stuff I liked. Whether it was, say like, “I Luv U,” or some of that stuff on Boy in da Corner, was like crunk. Crunk is just what trap was back then. Whatever trap is today, that’s what Lil' Jon and whoever and Three 6 Mafia were doing back then. But when it came to the R&B, I definitely couldn’t do it. That’s where “Jezebel” and them come from. Not from the content, but as the fact the... Who’s heard that song Foxy Brown? [sings] “Ooh baby, gotta get you home with me tonight.” I wrote “Jezebel” to that. I’m not an R&B guy, so I couldn’t do them sweet melody, them sweet chords, you know what I mean? [laughs] That’s what ended up coming out. Excuse obviously the content of what I was saying, obviously as well. But that’s the closest I could get, and “I Luv U Remix” that’s like the closest I could get to it. Duane Jones You clearly, you wasn’t kind of in love with anyone at that time? Dizzee Rascal I might have been. Duane Jones Really?! Dizzee Rascal You know I didn’t have a girlfriend, but I was about. You know you’ve got that little one in your trousers there as well. [laughs] I was about, yeah. Duane Jones Where was you mentally when you wrote Boy in da Corner? If you could describe your life at that time and where you was mentally. Happy? Sad? Angry? Scared? Dizzee Rascal A bit of all of that. A bit of all, because this is when I was just... I dropped out of college. That’s the reason I dropped out of college, because I went to Redbridge College for like nine months. The mistake I made was, I went college with loads of people I did go to school with. It became like a bit of a joke. It weren’t serious. Eventually one day I was sitting in class, making these beats. But these times, I had already been known with Nasty Crew. Anyone knows who Nasty Crew is. I was known in my college already. This is where... Who went to my college? See the... Of course Giggs was... Giggs was... Duane Jones Giggs, Buck? Dizzee Rascal Yeah. Duane Jones Yeah. Dizzee Rascal See, but I went to college with Buck. These times I was known already in there, so it was like, “Oh, what’s the point?” So I just dropped out, but aside from that, I didn’t have nothing else going on, other than being in the studio. These times, I was still in the studio with Cage and Wiley and all that. But outside of the studio, it was just badness. It was just a lot going on. Just through seeing loads of shit that I really shouldn’t have been seeing, I guess. From having too much time on my hands, and being around people that had too much time on their hands and were doing shit that they shouldn’t have been doing either. It affected me, so that’s where a lot of that stuff came from. Duane Jones Was there a lot of pressure? Because I think, everyone was looking at you at that time, as like the spearhead of grime. Dizzee Rascal I didn’t know that. Duane Jones Really. Dizzee Rascal No, I was just so into what I do. Like I said earlier, it was such a competitive thing. Like I said, this was a thing that let me be in the middle of fucking... Of a dance, surrounded by Brixton and Peckham youts. I know everything’s all grime 2.0 now, everything’s all mixed, and gentrified, or whatever you want to call it. But back then, yeah, that meant something, innit? Duane Jones Yeah. Dizzee Rascal You know what I mean. For real though. I forgot my point... Duane Jones Just, if you felt the pressure, did you feel the pressure from the outside world? Dizzee Rascal No, that’s what I mean. I just loved it so much, that I didn’t need no pressure to be this like, “You’re doing it for the scene, and doing it...” It wasn’t like that. It was just, “I need to make a song for the dance.” Like, “Rumble Stampede’s coming up, I need a banger for that,” or whatever, and eventually... [laughs] Who knows Rumble Stampede? Anybody? [shout from audience] Yeah, see, there. Then eventually, later on you had things like “Fix Up Look Sharp,” which was a dubplate for Westwood, because I wanted to get played on The Rap Show. Cos I still saw myself as a rapper. But again, I wasn’t able to make the rap of the day. What was that? Like, Dipset would’ve been big around those times, innit? I didn’t have access to that type of music anyways. Who did it? Cage made that one, he was just playing a record, I heard it, “What was that? Put that there, put that there,” and then I wrote the lyrics to it and all that. Everything on the album kind of had its... There was a reason for it, but it wasn’t because of like, “It’s time to spearhead grime, this is our time!” [laughs] Duane Jones Yeah. Dizzee Rascal It wasn’t like that. It’s like that now, innit? Because it all worked... This was just a pure honest thing. It was a real scene. It was just love, that’s it. Duane Jones Alright, we’ll get back to the genre grime in a sec, but “Fix Up Look Sharp” would you say that was a massive turning point for you, that record, in any way? Because I just felt... When I saw people moshing... Dizzee Rascal Do you want to know the god honest truth? I don’t want to, like, disappoint no one. Duane Jones The video was real crazy. Dizzee Rascal The whole album, especially the whole early days. I didn’t know what the fuck was really happening bruv. I was just in it. [laughs] Just in it. Then I got stabbed in Napa, then my mind was in a total different place because I lived in a council estate. I was running around, doing whatever, as well as making music. Just acting up, just a mad youth, and then I’ve been thrown into fame. It just became a case of just trying to, “OK, just stay in the studio. Do your shows or do what you need to do, and just keep it moving.” I can’t keep up. I didn’t really know or understand what was going on outside. Even all this is still mad to me. You don’t get used to it. I’m sitting in a room with you lot, talking about some shit I did 13 years ago. [laughs] And I can’t remember everything that happened. [laughs] Duane Jones Well, do your best please. Do your best! Dizzee Rascal Right, yeah! Duane Jones OK, can I take you back to the awards that you’ve won? Ivor Novello, Mercury, Brit. You’ve got a Mobo? Dizzee Rascal I’ve got a few, they didn’t send me them though. Duane Jones You’ve got a few Mobos. I just remember seeing you with a baggy t-shirt on, a picture of yourself. Dizzee Rascal Trying to sell that merch. Duane Jones Whose idea was that? Dizzee Rascal I feel it was probably my idea. [laughs] Duane Jones OK, clever. Clever. Holding the award to the camera, and I remember... This is the Mercury Award, right, yeah? I remember, I think it was the Mercury, just seeing you back on your council estate and your friends holding the award and you looking quite nonchalant about it. You’re just in the background, like you don’t really give a shit. Dizzee Rascal I didn’t know what it was supposed to be. No, you have to understand, like I said, who’d...? Like who watched the Mercury Awards in the hood? Come on bruv. For real. Back then. It wasn’t till Dynamite won it. Like, “Oh, Miss Dynamite’s won an award! Oh, wicked! What’s that?” We knew what the Mobos was obviously, we knew what the Brit Awards was, because the Brits is the biggest thing, innit. But the Mercury Awards, that’s like a cool industry music thing. That... If you go back and watch the video, I was miffed. [laughs] You know, it was like, “They’re coming, watch out, yeah!” Because I was supposed to do a speech then, and I didn’t know what a speech is. I thought, “Oh man, I’ve won this thing. Cool!” Then I went home to the estate, and passed it around, and was confused, basically. [applause] That’s the truth. The next morning, like I said, my first real taste of fame, like proper fame, like press, like paparazzi. Look at him, he’s got his camera there right now just as I'm speaking... Paparazzi downstairs like, “We’re not leaving until we get an interview.” “What do you mean, you’re not leaving until you get an interview?” Like, “You need to move, innit? What do you mean?” No, like not understanding that now there’s nothing you can do about it. It has to... You have to go down and do it. Daniel Shittu, footballer, he sorted that for me. He’s the one who eased it up and made me go down there, because you know I did... In fact, he was a big influence on me. Early, before everyone you’ve ever heard of was an influence on me. But he’s smooth, that’s when I learned how to... Duane Jones He’s still playing? He used to play for Watford. Dizzee Rascal He played for a bag of teams. QPR and all that. Yeah, so that was my... That’s to say... The whole thing was just weird. Eventually I did it, they went away, but it was just mad to throw someone into that situation. I mean, and I was young, so that was crazy. Duane Jones How long... I mean, a lot of this attention was because of Boy in da Corner. You know, it’s incredible. But how long did it take you to make the album? Are you one of those MCs that kind of, it takes you days to make a track? Or do you go in there and just kind of like, no piece of paper, just spill it off top, and all that? What’s the working process like for you in the studio? Dizzee Rascal Those times it was... I just went in there and I had fun. I just had so many ideas. Cage would have a load of samples and a load of things up on the computer. For me this is like, “Fucking, oh, like this all at my disposal?” He’d lay all the samples out across the keyboard. “Yeah, I like that sound. I like that.” Then I’ll just play it. So, like “I Luv U” [mimics drum pattern] And just keep going. There was times I was so excited, I just played the whole thing all the way through. That’s how it was then. But as far as the process... I don’t know man, different days then I’ll just go and try out different things. I remember going to Sheffield at one point. We kind of finished the album there. But as far as the process, honestly, I don’t think I even really thought about the process, until maybe the third album. I was just doing it in the first album. Just doing it, and then it kind of... I got a record deal off the back of what I’d done. Then it’s the third album. Once you’ve had a few albums out, and you know that, “Rah, I make albums. I’m going to be on the TV. I’m going to be on the radio. They’re going to promote me. It’s time to make an album,” and then you start thinking. That’s when I started experimenting more. I don’t know, something like “Sirens.” Alright well, I’d never really played live instruments. So I get out the drum kit. I’m like, I’m not an amazing drummer, but let me try a little ting there. I definitely can’t play the guitar, but give me the guitar. [laughs] Fuck around with this thing here quickly. Tweak it, do some shit to it, and then had a thing rolling, and then, “Aha, you know what? You know what would be wicked? If we put Korn...” Like I said, I was into Korn. I said, “Ah, ‘Here to Stay.’” Does anyone know that song, “Here to Stay”? I was like, “Yeah, I like that let’s... So for the shows, I’m going to do this, and then put Korn at the end of this, so that everyone moshes.” That’s when we got into, “OK, we can get that thing that you like, replayed.” So if you hear the end of “Sirens,” that is just basically “Here to Stay” being replayed. But that’s the kind of thought process I was in by the third album. In the first album, I was just doing it. Obviously the raves, and the whole pirate scene, that had a big influence. That started to have less of an influence as I started going on. Duane Jones It is a grime album though, right? Dizzee Rascal At the time... Wiley cosigned all that grime shit and all that eski shit. Because basically, I was doing that before him. Wiley was making “Wickedest Ting” and before that “Nicole’s Groove,” and all those garage-y tunes. That was his take on vocal garage. Duane Jones You being in the thick of it, when was the first time you heard the label “grime”? Dizzee Rascal I was in Mile End, and someone said, “Yeah, yeah! You lot are making that grime, innit?” I said, “What do you mean?” I didn’t just see it as that, but I was making what I was making in 2001. I got a track called “Boy Dem About,” a track called “Crime.” Duane Jones Yeah, Cage is going to send me that. He promised to send me that. Dizzee Rascal Yeah, those early ones where I was sampling Three 6 Mafia records but it was the first thing where I was doing the grimy basslines and all that shit there. But the grime thing, like I said Wiley, he put the eski thing on it to kind of claim it. I’m not going to be, “This is Eski, this is my thing.” It’s all in the same genre thing. But I never really saw myself as like, “Ah, I am grime, this is grime. We are grime. We do grime!” [laughs] I just experimented with stuff. Even at the time... The way people talk about Boy in da Corner as cool now, but at the time, there was a lot of people that didn’t get it and thought, “Oh, what the fuck is this? This is car crash music.” You have to think about what else was out, around the time. As far as hip-hop, there was all Dipset, all sorts of stuff there. My shit just sounded odd. Duane Jones Where was the push back from? Was there a push back from mainstream radio, or was there a push back from pirate radio, once you dropped Boy in da Corner, or was everyone just really receptive to it? Dizzee Rascal Bruv, I don't know. Like I said, all different sets of people had different shit to say about it. The hood had one thing to say about it, the fucking whoever... The hipsters, the cool people, the tastemakers, they had one thing to say about it. Whatever. I just kind of got on with it. I had other things on my mind, you know? Duane Jones You know, when you make a classic album, some artists suffer from it. You know, because fans and everyone says, “I want a Part Two.” You know, Jay Z, whatever, whoever suffers from that. Have you felt yourself suffering from it, and what would you say to the people that say to you... Dizzee Rascal It's a pain in the fucking arse like, “Go and make Boy in da Corner 2.” “Fucking leave me alone brother, I was like 17. What the fuck’s the matter with you?” But, to be fair, this all started happening with social media. I didn’t have that pressure in 2004, 2005, because there wasn’t no way of telling me that [laughs]. Let’s be real, innit? The good part of it is that I’m sitting here with you lot now, because social media has brought it back up to my attention. Because I’m an artist, I’m just trying to make the next thing, the next thing. “OK, what excites me? Let me try and make that.” But this album, I guess this is what Nas’ Illmatic would be to the... I understand it, and I get it. But no, there wasn’t that pressure back then. I just rolled straight into my second album. Just straight away, because I just made that decision... I could go one of two ways, innit? It could just go really bad, or I can just get on with it. Luckily, I was the young kid around Pay As You Go and More Fire and, whoever, Maxwell. I got to see where some people went wrong. I got to see the real dark side of it. I got to see whatever, the extortion attempts, the kidnappings, the whatever. All the other extra shit that no one don’t talk about today. I saw it all as a kid. I saw people’s friends turn on them. I saw all sorts of shit. Luckily, I learned to move a bit different then. I’m glad there was no social media then as well, because the draw-outs were less. The draw-outs were just like... If you was out on the street and someone decided they wanted to... It was just on, just there and then. There weren’t 500 people to tell you, “Oh, you’re a prick!”, just online. [laughs] Just because. And then DMing you, "Wha gawn though!" It was easier back then. Duane Jones Is that one of the hardest things about being Dizzee Rascal, or was one of the hardest things is moving through that? Dizzee Rascal Yeah, trying to maneuver between being just a boy from a regular council estate, working class area in London. To being thrown into fame, or being thrown on the telly, and then maneuvering through the industry. Already maneuvering through the rave scene was one thing, there’s all sorts of characters in there. Everyone from dodgy promoters, to gangsters to whatever. All sorts of people that you have to try and tread the line. Your other friends, some of your friends are still doing whatever they’re doing. They’re not understanding why they’re not following you to every show, or why they can’t be around, or why they can’t do this, why they can’t that, and then people turn on you, and you have to deal with that. This guy today thinks he wants to do me something. I can’t let him do me something. But these people all think I’m a role model, so what you’re doing? OK, then can I just make music then? Just try and mind my own business. It’s not so much now though. Duane Jones You know what? You’re influenced clearly by Three 6 Mafia. What is about Three 6 Mafia, or Bun B, because I don’t feel a lot of people in the UK often use them as reference points. As their heroes. Dizzee Rascal Because they don’t know. They don’t know that Three 6 Mafia started all this crunk shit, that eventually became trap. They think Atlanta is where all that shit come from, and it kind of comes from Memphis. But I was into that then. When I was making Boy in da Corner, I was listening to, “Ass, titties, ass and titties, ass...” [laughs] They got it from DJ Assault, from Detroit anyway, that was just a remake, but that whole crunk sound was just dark. But it was the same tempo as garage, what was going on over here. Imagine when Timbaland made “Is That Your Chick?” Remember that? For Jay Z. That’s where “I Luv U” come from. It was a cross between that and “What’s Your Fantasy?” [by] Ludacris. The call-and-response with a girl and all that shit there. That was my take on both of those tracks, but when they came out they were both odd tunes. They were different for the day, innit? But they were the tempo that we was all used to here, because of garage and then especially the darker side of garage. Like I said, like... Musical Mob when all that kind of stuff started to get a bit bouncy and a bit darker. That was more us. Duane Jones I was there when you came out with Stormzy, at Wireless [Festival in 2015], which was an amazing moment. It’s kind of like the old school, if you don’t mind me calling you that? The old school and the new school. What was that like for you? Dizzee Rascal It was different. I’ve never done that before. It was different, because if I’m honest, I haven’t seen anybody... I’ve worked with every younger, who has come out, who they’ve said, “Ah, this is the next Dizzee Rascal.” Over the years I’ve always worked with them and that. But I’ve never seen anybody... His level as far as the shows he’s commanding, and his performing ability. It felt good to go in there with him. Like, “Wow, it’s all professional, it’s all...” and then I went like, “Rah, he kept the elements of everything that was going on back in the day.” It’s like, “Rah, no then. No, he’s real.” That felt good. That was when I saw, again, another next generation of kids. He’s there saying, “Oh, I was on the roads when Dizzee made ‘I Luv U.’” They definitely don’t know “I Luv U” that well, they weren’t on the roads. It’s mad. I’m at that stage in my career now like, “Oh shit, I’m getting older then.” Like time goes. You’re not just going to stay young forever. Some people got this image of me in my hoodie, that’s all they’re going to remember and all they’re going to accept. Like, I'm in my 30s now, it's done, innit? But that definitely let me know. Duane Jones Yeah, that’s interesting, because I think, how do you feel... I think one thing you don’t get enough credit for, I think a lot of people might think that, “Why is Dizzee still so relevant?” Your live show is awesome and it always has... Dizzee Rascal The cheeky cunts, what do they mean? [laughs] That’s what I’m saying, this is the problem with social media. They’re cheeky bastards bro. Because for 13 years... OK, everyone’s all gassed up now, with the 2.0, but what the fuck do you think I’ve been doing for 13 years? You think I’ve just been here waiting? “Oh, it’s coming!” [laughs] You know? Fuck you're talking about. I’ve been around the world bruv, doing this stuff. Duane Jones Well, fuck them. Middle finger up to them. You’ve made me forget my question now. How well do you think... How does your music connect with younger people now, when you perform at these festivals? Does it still connect, the Boy in da Corner stuff, would you say? Dizzee Rascal If I’m honest, I don’t think they know it, bruv, majority of them. Obviously they’re going to know the newer stuff. That’s what I noticed from a lot of these shows. All of the hype I hear, “Ah, you're going to be playing Boy in da Corner,” I’ve been playing those songs in my set for 13 years around the world but time goes on, innit? If you’ve got younger people, they’re not going to hear “I Luv U” and get excited about it the same way that someone my age, or a bit younger is. You know what I mean? But if they feel it, they bounce along to it, but they’re just not going to know it like that, but because of the resurgence of the album and everything that’s been going on recently, they want to hear it. I see the request, “Oh, can you play ‘Stop Dat’?” Or, “Are you going to play ‘Stop Dat’? Make sure you play ‘Stop Dat.’” “Oh, I’ll play ‘Stop Dat,’ cool.” Duane Jones With the new school generation of grime, do you intend to work with any of them, and is there any names you can tell us, that you’re working with? Dizzee Rascal Bruv if I hear something that’s good, then I’ll do it. Anyone can say... Well, look. I did it with Feki. Feki’s not a new school grime guy, or whatever you want to call it, but he sent me a track, I liked it, and I jumped on it. But not just because, “Oh, this is the new guy that they’re saying is the new guy today. He’s gonna bring us back.” Like, just gonna jump on a riddim, that’s it. Duane Jones Yeah. Alright, I know we can’t expect a Boy in da Corner 2, but what can we expect from the new... Dizzee Rascal Alright, how would Boy in da Corner 2 sound? If anyone’s got any suggestions, I’m here now, innit [laughs] Duane Jones I think a lot of people might say they want to hear you produce a whole album. Dizzee Rascal That’s what you said to me. That’s what you said to me. No, backstage. I do feel that, but the thing is, that could happen too. I just need... Duane Jones I want to hear an album produced by you... Again. Dizzee Rascal That’s all jiggy. That’s cool. That is cool, but it’s just whatever I feel. Sometimes I make beats, I might sit there and make beats and I might not feel it. The words just might not just come out. Someone else might give me a beat, and I might just write a whole song there and then. It’s just getting back into that production, get into... It was a different time. I stopped making beats probably after my third album. You have to remember why I made beats in the first place. I made beats, because I couldn’t get beats from nobody else. Who was I going to get beats from? That’s a big part of it. I was so in love with it, that’s where that shit came from, innit? Then you just get a bit older, you try different things and you just get used to thousands of people jumping around to “Bonkers” and the hunger just ain’t the same. Like I said, I’ve sat there, I tried to make beats, but sometimes I don’t feel it. Duane Jones What can we expect from the new album then? Dizzee Rascal Fucking hell. Obviously it’s going to be harder, because I’ve recognized that a lot of people were saying they want some hard shit. I’m not going to sound like an angry 17 year old. I can promise you that, but there’s going to be some hard shit. Mainly because that’s what I’m into as well. It needs to be... I like rap music. I pride myself on knowing a lot about rap. Another part is, the reason I liked rap music so much from all different areas and regions around the world, and all that, you got a sense of where they were from, and what they were about. That’s what I would manage do to with a few of my albums, but especially Boy in da Corner. I’d hope to do that again, but just without it sounding the same. Just pure rap, but then, like I said, shit needs to be catchy, shit needs to mean something and it’s just a different time. So I’m just working on it, working on it and try not to fall to the pressure on that. You have to remember, I’m on my sixth album now. Duane Jones It’s crazy, innit? Dizzee Rascal Yeah. A lot’s happened in that time. I’ve been around and seen a lot. Making stuff that people are interested in hearing as well. People have gaps. I was watching a documentary on Daft Punk. Now they had like four years in between albums and shit like that, to just experiment and just try as much different shit as they can. Duane Jones Yeah, we don’t want to wait four years though, bruv. Dizzee Rascal It’s been four years, since my last... Duane Jones Another four years though. Dizzee Rascal Right. Right. I’m on it. Duane Jones How many records you’ve sold, would you say? Dizzee Rascal I honestly don’t know, bruv? I don’t know. Enough. [laughs] Duane Jones The mind boggles. Yeah. Yeah. The mind boggles. Alright cool, so I’m going to open up to the audience now. You’ve got your opportunity, just raise your hand anyone. If I’ve missed any questions that need to be asked. OK, so we’ll go to that guy just behind the camera there. Yeah, that’s you, bro. Audience Member Hi. My name is Jay. Dizzee Rascal Yo, what’s happening bruv? Audience Member Before I even ask my question, I just want to say thank you for the inspiration and influence you’ve had on our generation. Dizzee Rascal Respect, bruv. Audience Member I’m from East too, so it’s just love. Dizzee Rascal Where you from? Audience Member Canning Town, E16. Dizzee Rascal Yeah. Audience Member My question I’m going to ask, I heard you mention a lot about, even just briefly just now, you mention how it’s your sixth album and you’ve been a lot of places. Even being stabbed in Napa and the kidnapping, all of that stuff. I heard you mention a lot of stuff. What would you say, up to this point, was the one thing that kept you sane to this point? Because you’ve done a lot, you’ve seen a lot. You still inspire us as artists and as people, coming from probably a similar background. What was the one thing that you probably stood by till this day and that’s shaped you and kept you humble, or the person you are today? Dizzee Rascal This shit works, bruv. I set out to make some music and it worked. You just have to just keep going. Everyday. Sometimes I question it, you always have times where you like, “What the fuck is all this about?” Then you just like, “Well, let me just get in the studio.” That’s it, and then being able to feed your family. Audience Member For real. Yeah man, thanks man. Appreciate that. Dizzee Rascal Respect G. Duane Jones Thank you bro. We’ve got this guy in the front here please. Dizzee Rascal Hey. Audience Member Hi, I'm Sid? I’m currently training to be a doctor and I dedicate my med school offer to your first album. Dizzee Rascal Alright thank you, bruv. Audience Member It really helped me. [applause] Now I’m working for a charity called Street Doctors. What we do is, we go to the local Youth Offending Centres and we work with kids, ages 11 to 17, who are currently involved in a lot of street violence. What we do is teach them first aid and trying to change their attitudes towards it. Dizzee Rascal That’s amazing. Audience Member What would your advice be to these type of kids who feel trapped, because that’s the vibe I feel from them all the time? Dizzee Rascal You have to find out what you really like, man, and use that same energy you’d use to show everyone that you’re not having it, like you'd blow a man up and lick a man down, and put it into what you really like. You’ll be amazed how far you can go with it, man, because if people see you’re serious, people want to be around serious people and then serious things happen, sometimes it’s serious money and serious situations. It can go anywhere. Duane Jones Thank you very much, man. There’s a guy there in a stripey shirt. Audience Member It’s a jumper, mate. Duane Jones It’s a jumper! [laughs] It’s nice. Audience Member How do you keep wanting to do music, and keep working, considering the Queen probably knows who you are? You did the Opening Ceremony [at the Olympics in 2012]. It’s like the biggest thing in the world, it’s like 360 million people must’ve watched you. Dizzee Rascal It’s a billion. [laughs / applause] Audience Member What do you do next? What is next? Dizzee Rascal That’s what... Exactly. Every time you make an album you go through the same thing, “Oh, what do I do next? Oh, have I still got it? Oh, can I still do it? Oh, it’s not working.” Then you find your flow, and then you just keep going, man. I mean, you see other people doing their thing, then you’re like, “Oh shit! I need to do my thing then.” Duane Jones What’s driving you with this album then? What’s the main thing, because you’ve had different drives for different albums. What’s driving you with this album? What would you say it is? Dizzee Rascal Obviously, the scene’s popping, innit? I can’t act like I can’t see it. So it’s like, “Rah," but I haven’t got the same stuff to say as everybody else necessarily, you know what I mean? Just the fact of just being in it. Even just listening to loads of old school shit. Listening to shit from the ’90s that I wasn’t even into then, and stuff I was into and understanding what they’re saying differently because I’m older. Like, “Oh shit, is that was he was saying? Rah.” I didn’t know what he meant when I was 15. Trying to make a classic body of work again that sonically, sound-quality wise, is going to make people engage. It’s going to be engaging, make people respect it. Not just hype, I still can’t... I can’t just put out just hype, if I’m going to put out an album, I can’t pull out nothing with just fillers. I understand that it needs to be a cohesive body of work. That’s what drives me. Duane Jones Aite. It's all this side of the room, what’s going on with this side? This guy in a cap there. Audience Member Wha gwan big man. I see you’ve done loads in America, all the way through your career. You’ve always stayed faithful to America. I was surprised when Sway was reeling off facts, and facts and facts about you. Do you know what I’m saying? Do you think that America should be a big target for upcoming artists now? Dizzee Rascal Yeah, why not man? In the end of the day, you’re always going to... It’s always been the way... Whether it's been with reggae, rap, rock or whatever. We’ve always looked up to over there, because that’s where a lot of stuff came from in the first place. You always going to want to kind of impress them. It’s a huge market, and everyone thinks they can make millions and all that as well. But even I know that if I’m not talking to the man down the road, then it’s not going to connect here or there. Sometimes it does, for certain people. Sometimes in America, the stuff that they get they understand is stuff that’s more of an attempt to sound like what they’re doing. They get it in their own way, and deal with it in their own way. But what got me big in the first place was talking to fucking someone in East London, or South London, or North London, and then it went out to the suburbs. Duane Jones Thank you, bruv. We literally got one more minute left and four hands up. Eeny, meeny... Let’s go this side of the room. Audience Member Yo Dizzee, you good? My question is, over your whole six albums, what has been your most creative period? Freeing for you, like you felt, “I’ve got no strings attached. I can do what I want.” Has there... Or do you feel is that yet to come? Dizzee Rascal It’s probably my first album, Boy in da Corner and then my fourth. Because the first one, there was no expectations. Then the fourth one is where I went independent again. It’s like I went back to square one. It just went mad. Those were the two. Duane Jones We got time for one more? We got time for a couple more. We'll go to this guy and then we'll make our way up to you. Audience Member Thank you. Hello. I just want to ask about the Asher D battle on Choice FM because that was a big event of my youth. You obviously used the lyrics, didn’t you, in Boy in da Corner? Dizzee Rascal Right. Right. Right. Audience Member It was quite a meaningful thing. I was going to say, how big of an event was that for you? Dizzee Rascal Not as big as it seems like it was for you! [laughs] But there’s been loads of things that just, from back then. Like the Crazy Titch thing. Duane Jones It was big for me as well. Dizzee Rascal People still watch that shit, but to me it’s just like, “Rah, you lot are still on that?” It’s become legendary, but that’s amazing too, innit? It is what it is. Duane Jones Does that get on your nerves, if people talk about the Crazy Titch incident? Dizzee Rascal Yeah, it depends how they talk about it. [laughs] It depends on what they think they know. Duane Jones But this gentleman just spoke about it as very inspiring. It’s an exciting moment, man. Dizzee Rascal On the outside, yeah. I guess. Duane Jones Oh, for you it wasn’t fun? Let’s talk about Asher D, was it fun? Dizzee Rascal It weren’t a game, not really. All these things, these beefs, sometime they spill over and get serious. It’s always a bit of entertainment for everyone. Especially now even more. Everyone’s getting involved in the clash and online and things. It’s like, it can get very peak. Then there’s a lot of misinformation that goes along, that becomes a legend along with it. Especially if you’re like myself and you just try and stay in the background and get on with shit. It is what it is, man. Duane Jones Alright. Is there any musical sounds that you regret? Is there any song that you regret? Dizzee Rascal I don’t regret shit, bruv. [laughs] Duane Jones Because you know when... In terms of working with labels, sometimes artists have to compromise. Have you ever found yourself in that situation, where you’ve had to compromise? Dizzee Rascal You know what? I must say, yeah. With the situation I’m in now, I’m so surprised and I’m so humbled and grateful, because I thought me being with a major label, would be the complete opposite of what it has been. It’s been so easy. It’s been so calm and accommodating. I haven’t got a bad word to say. The freedom I’ve had to just do, it’s been great. As far as compromise, if there’s been a compromise ever it hasn’t been because of the label thinks I should do this, or do that. It’s because, “I want to try this, and what’s going to happen if I do that?” Sometimes it goes well, like you want it to, and sometimes, “God, I feel I just need to make a new song, and keep it moving.” Sometimes that happens, but that’s supposed to, innit? Duane Jones What’s the most experimental song you said, you would say you’ve made that did what you wanted it to do? Dizzee Rascal “Bonkers,” because I didn’t really quite know how that was going to go. It just was like he sent me it, it’s like, “Oh, this is something I would’ve hated when I was a kid.” But I understand it now, because at the time I was what? 20 something, and I’d been to Ibiza. Until I was 18, LA was the first place I ever traveled to, and that was to do the “Fix Up Look Sharp” video. Then Napa was the second place I ever traveled to, but before that, I never left England. I didn’t understand what all that fucking house music was all about. I understood garage, because garage and that, was a bit harder, a bit jiggier, innit? The hood was into garage as well, innit? But house, it was a feeling like it was a bit older, I didn’t really have no connection to it. When I started going to Ibiza, that’s when I started understanding it. That’s when things like “Bonkers” and “Dance Wiv Me” and “Holiday” and all dem ones because I started understanding about, “Ah, just this fun, and having a good time, and positive vibes, and energy, and that.” Before that, it was all just kind of dark. Duane Jones I think the mic’s made its way downstairs now. Yeah? Audience Member What's good Diz? When Dirtee Stank first opened and you signed D Double E and Footsie, I was like, “This could be the equivalent of Def Jam, but a grime version.” What stopped you from being the UK equivalent of Russell Simmons for our scene? Dizzee Rascal Russell Simmons weren’t a spitter as well. He weren’t an artist, so there’s that. [laughs] Audience Member Forget the lyric part. Forget the lyric part, I’m talking about business, the business acumen. The actual structure, the infrastructure of the label and signing the best artist. Was it the responsibility of putting the scene under your wing? What prevented you? Dizzee Rascal When you say, “put the scene under my wing,” that’s what I mean. This is all like, we’re not in school, innit? Like all this, “Aw, bring me in. Bring ...” All this talk of all this imaginary scene thing, I don’t know what all that means? I just... Yeah, a bag of people. I’ve known D Double E, since I was 14. I grew up listening to him. Just being around him and having him about and making music with him. It just so happens that I’ve got a record label. You have to remember I had a record label when I was 16, bruv. It just started off as just something to put out records, then it’s a situation, but as far as trying to... You just do what you can, innit? If it pops, it pops. I don’t know what else I could have done. They put out the music they wanted to put out. I did too. I don’t know, we’re still bredrens, you know what I mean? They’ll be there tomorrow. Duane Jones Dizzee, thank you for being here today. Thank you for all of the energy, time and excellence you’ve put into music man. You’ve touched so many people and you’ve changed, not even talking about grime, like UK music. You've changed it, bro. Dizzee Rascal Thank you, bruv. Duane Jones Long may that continue as well. Thank you man. Round of applause for Dizzee Rascal please. [applause]