Prins Thomas

Norwegian DJ and producer Prins Thomas made a splash in the early 2000s with his twisted-to-fit “space disco” sounds. But don’t call it that because he isn’t a fan of genre tags. In addition to production and an ever-busy DJ schedule, Thomas also acts as label manager for Full Pupp.

In this lecture at the 2007 Red Bull Music Academy, the Norwegian disco superhero retraces the key sounds of his formative years.

Hosted by Gerd Janson Audio Only Version Transcript:

Gerd Janson

This gentleman to the left of me is a guy from Oslo, Norway, he’s running a label called Full Pupp, been producing music with a guy called Hans-Peter Lindstrøm, and is on the forefront of the recent resurgence of… disco.

Prins Thomas

Don’t say it…

Gerd Janson

Of the d-dot music… And his name is Prins Thomas and he’s a bit afraid of falling asleep next to me, so please give him a loud and warm welcome. [applause]

Prins Thomas

Thank you.

Gerd Janson

So you see people love you already. But how would you explain to the proverbial old lady on a plane seat next to you what you are doing for a living?

Prins Thomas

I would say that I make dance music. That’s the easiest expression to get away with. Try not to be too specific to anybody when trying to explain what I do.

Gerd Janson

But the old lady thinks of waltz and stuff like that if you talk of dance music.

Prins Thomas

Let her.

Gerd Janson

You don’t want to get into a conversation with her at all, huh?

Prins Thomas

When I was nine years old and breakdancing, my grandmother used to put on Harry Belafonte and asked me to do some breakdance and I obliged. There was no reason to try and get her to understand what breakdance music was. She wouldn’t get it.

Gerd Janson

So Belafonte was fine with you? And what came after Belafonte, when you ruined your hips and your knees?

Prins Thomas

I’m not sure.

Gerd Janson

Afrika Bambaataa maybe after Belafonte?

Prins Thomas

Yeah, maybe.

Gerd Janson

And when did you pick up being actively interested in making music instead of just dancing to it?

Prins Thomas

I think it was about the same time, like ‘84 or ‘85. I had seen some documentaries about graffiti on Norwegian television. There was a really good book called Subway Art that got me enthused about the whole hip-hop culture. Then you had Beat Street and, I guess, for all the kids my age it was the cool thing to do. But at the same time I was taking cello lessons and playing clarinet and my parents used to play me all kinds of different music. I mean, we used to go to the opera and see operas. Go to the church and hear classical music. Be taken to jazz concerts. So to me it’s always been a mixture of all kinds of stuff. And then I went from breakdancing with a lot of people, suddenly I was the only one still into that kind of music and playing around in my bedroom with belt-driven turntables and learning to mix the old school way, where you have to push the record all the time, which is to beat mix.

Gerd Janson

And sounds a bit rough at times, huh?

Prins Thomas

No, I think I was actually quite good at it. When I later started playing with Technics turntables I used them in a nightclub and it took me one mix and it was down. It was like, “This is easy!” Turntables actually do all the work for you. I learned the hard way first.

Gerd Janson

But they don’t call you king yet?

Prins Thomas

No, no.

Gerd Janson

I just interrupted you talking about your cello lessons and the breakdancing.

Prins Thomas

I thought I was going to try to break myself off before any of you fall asleep.

Gerd Janson

Oh yeah, if anyone has questions, don’t hesitate to ask them, just wait for the microphone. It doesn’t have to be a question round at the end. So? Cello?

Prins Thomas

OK, OK, my life story. I played the cello badly for a few years and I tried to learn to play the bass guitar with a teacher. It kind of killed my enthusiasm for learning any kind of instrument.

Gerd Janson

The teacher or the bass?

Prins Thomas

The teacher. Going to classes and learning stuff from someone else. So what really got me into music was I joined a really lousy punk band in ‘91 or ‘92. I was still buying some early house stuff and still buying some hip-hop music but I was just taken by doing something new and I had a punk revolution in ‘91-’92. And then I played in all sorts of different bands for a couple of years and then got back to DJing again by accident. A friend of mine opened one of the first house clubs in Norway and asked me to be the weekday bartender and DJ. So I served beers and played my old records and after a while I found out, well, I should stick to DJing. I was actually better at serving beers to myself.

Gerd Janson

You were your own best customer?

Prins Thomas

Yeah, that’s always bad for a bartender.

Gerd Janson

And was there a big scene in Norway at the time for house music or dance music?

Prins Thomas

The early ‘90s to mid-’90s, there was a growing scene. All the clubs put on house nights, drum & bass nights, there was a lot of stuff happening and a few record stores opened. Most of it was based in Oslo, the capital city where I’m living, but it died out. People had too much to choose from and most people weren’t that interested, it was more like a fad.

Gerd Janson

Too much to choose from, like there were too many things going on?

Prins Thomas

I think only in Oslo. I think in the whole of Norway there’s three million people living so it’s a really small country. I think there were maybe 40 or 50 DJs making a full-time living out of DJing. Before I started making records I used to be a DJ making a living DJing only in Norway for at least 12 years.

Gerd Janson

You played every day?

Prins Thomas

No, but often four, five days a week.

Gerd Janson

And is there much of a scene right now? Because you’re not the only guy from Norway doing dance music and releasing it, peers like Todd Terje and Rune Lindbæk and Hans Peter Lindstrøm, one could think that there’s this big thing happening?

Prins Thomas

I wouldn’t say that there’s a big scene, but there’s a gang of people who know each other and at some point we’ve worked with each other in some form. But I think when the commercial nightlife in Oslo died out, from ‘95 to 2000 maybe, it just went downhill and some of us started focusing more on going into the studio and making music. For me, I’m DJing because I found it really boring to be playing the same venues over and over again, and when I played in bands we went into the studio and recorded demos. I wanted to make music but I never had the time or the energy to do it when I was DJing full-time so I decided just to cut down on gigs and make music.

Gerd Janson

So maybe you could play something for us of your own music so that people who haven’t heard about you or your stuff get an idea what you’re about?

Prins Thomas

Is there anything you want to hear? I’m not actually sure that I’ve got anything of my own music here.

Gerd Janson

Maybe the one you're least proud of.

Prins Thomas

I’m usually so fed up with my own stuff that when I’m finished I never play it again. So usually, what I have with me is stuff I’m working on. Work in progress.

Gerd Janson

You could use a laptop to flip through all those files, huh?

Prins Thomas

I have everything on my hard-disks, I don't dare bring them out of the house.

Gerd Janson

And you don’t care about playing with a laptop either?

Prins Thomas

No, no, that’s too fancy. This is a remix I’ve just done. It’s a bit of cheating, it’s a remix on my own label.

(music: Ytre Rymden Dansskola — “Kjappfot (Prins Thomas Multitrack edit)” / applause)

Thank you. Buy the record.

Gerd Janson

It’s on your own label Full Pupp. What is the name meaning?

Prins Thomas

Actually, directly translated it’s an expression like “full gas,” like push the pedal or something. It also means big tits. Yeah, wow.

Gerd Janson

You’re putting out only Norwegian artists, right?

Prins Thomas

Yeah, on Full Pupp there’s only good friends of mine.

Gerd Janson

You don’t care about other people then?

Prins Thomas

No. Well, I got another label for all the other stuff, which is starting up now. It’s called Internasjonal.

Gerd Janson

What does that name mean?

It's actually international in Norwegian. But the idea was actually to give my friends a kick in the ass as well as myself. And until Feedelity, Lindstrøm’s label started and my label started, most people I knew, when they made music they sent it out to English labels or American labels. And I thought that was kind of silly, giving the attention to labels that didn’t back you up or didn’t pay you or anything. I thought doing a Norwegian label with Norwegian artists hopefully would bring some attention to Norway. And I decided it isn’t a scene but the scene as in my friends and so far it has worked very well.

Gerd Janson

And how hard do you find to keep a record label running these days with all the lamentations about no one is selling any copies any more and “blah, blah, blah.” Is it slowing down?

Prins Thomas

I think that’s felt by people who made a living from doing labels or actually once had the possibility to have somebody in to do the promo, someone in to be secretary or whatever, and that’s not the case with this label. All the money we earn on the label, we just put directly back into the label again. I make my living on DJing and doing remixes, so this is just a bonus if we earn any money. And I think we already earned enough to terrorize people with these crappy records for a couple more years without selling even, we can still go on.

Gerd Janson

You just mentioned remixes, that’s what you do mainly when you’re producing? You’re in demand with your remixes, maybe you could talk a little bit about how you approach doing your remixes.

Prins Thomas

I’ve done remixes mainly because I find it easy to do them. I find it really hard to make my own tracks from scratch. I can work with other people and have somebody else pushing me, but to make my own tracks it’s really difficult.

Gerd Janson

You have no ideas?

Prins Thomas

I do have ideas, but with remixes it’s like you have the original track, which is alternative A and with all these parts you can come up with alternative B. And I might spend only six hours doing a remix and I’ll be really happy with it and I’ve made a new track, basically. And I might as well have said, “OK, sorry, I can’t do the remix, remove the vocal parts and have my own track.” But I’m not that smart. They come very easily for me, I don’t know why. I might be very sloppy but still I get offered to do them. I must be doing something right, or maybe I’m just cool at the moment, I don’t know.

Gerd Janson

Do you actually have to like a song or a track if you get offered to remix it?

Prins Thomas

Sometimes I’ve gotten tracks and I’ve hated it and just thought, “Well, I should show them how the track should have been.” But yeah, nowadays I try to weed out basically the ones that are most interesting to do for me, not necessarily the ones that pay the most, but something I enjoy doing. And I never have any rules. Like I always start with a blank sheet every time. Sometimes I use only parts from the original, sometimes if the track is really badly produced, I might go to the studio and re-record everything. With some tracks I have done with Lindstrøm, we made just taking the vocals and we re-recorded everything, like drums, bass, guitars, made up new melodies. So yeah, there’s never any rules.

Gerd Janson

So you also did an album with this Lindstrøm guy, right? You could feed off of his ideas?

Prins Thomas

With him, I think the main difference when working together for both of us is we can blame each other. Like, we both have our own projects where you always have specific ideas of what you want to do, but when we work in the studio together we’ll try to let the other ideas come through. Doesn’t matter if you think it’s shit when you hear it. Just, “OK, let him have it.” It’s a very democratic form of music-making.

Gerd Janson

And you showed us one of your remixes. Maybe you could play us something that was very influential or is very influential in what you’re doing? Like music that inspired you?

Prins Thomas

Yeah. Let me see. [looks through record bag] I mean, I could play anything basically, but something specific. This is actually harder...

Gerd Janson

Than you thought?

Prins Thomas

I’m inspired by a lot of different things. For me, it’s probably harder to say what my music is inspired by or play something that sounds a little bit like it, it’s more like it’s a mixture of all types of things.

Gerd Janson

That’s an approach you are also following when you are DJing, right? A mixture of all kinds of things?

Prins Thomas

I try to. Sometimes I go the easy way and just play a bunch of new records I like. But I always try to mix it up and keep it exciting. To me, exciting is not just playing the same kind of records all night or one specific genre of music. To play with tempos and moods. I mean, even though I think it sounds horrible when you say, “you are going to take them on a journey,” or whatever, I like to build things up but I like to break it up sometimes, put on an AC/DC track or something.

Gerd Janson

Like writing a book then, right?

Prins Thomas

No, it’s like playing records. [laughter]

Gerd Janson

Well, then maybe something exciting?

Prins Thomas

Something exciting? OK.

Gerd Janson

But you don’t like to be pigeon-holed, right? Into that whole cosmic, whatever DJ kind of genre thing?

Prins Thomas

It’s one of the better ones to be put into.

Gerd Janson

It could be worse?

Prins Thomas

Yeah, it could be worse, but I like all sorts of music. Something exciting, let me see, oh yeah.

(music: LCD Soundsystem — “Us Vs Them (Any Color U Like Remix by Windsurf)” / applause)

Gerd Janson

That was epic.

Prins Thomas

Yeah, epic is the word.

Gerd Janson

I think we have a question?

Audience Member

I couldn’t help but notice some similarities with Lindstrøm’s music. The sequenced beats, the use of percussion and this float-y feeling. Do you think you can talk about a Norwegian sound or a Scandinavian sound?

Prins Thomas

Yeah, I mean, the first thing is we share a studio so it’s all recorded in the same room. The remix I played is actually a remix of a Lindstrøm track, so that’s not that weird. It’s harder for me to say anything about a Norwegian sound because to me, I think it’s really diverse. I think what we have in common is probably different reference points than, say, if you come from New York, you then have a different idea of what “classics” is and house music is. It’s a few things that are house music in all these genres. But I think it’s more diverse in Norway. We haven’t really had any scenes where you stick with one type of music, so I think Norway’s sound – if there is one – is more about mixing up all your influences and doing something new with it. I think what most of us have in common is disco.

Gerd Janson

You said it now.

Prins Thomas

Yeah, oh damn! But disco can be anything too. At least to my ears. I mean, I can say I play contemporary disco and I wouldn’t be lying, it’s contemporary music made for discos.

Audience Member

Do you ever do remixes for free?

Prins Thomas

Yeah, yeah, if there’s a track I really like. Sometimes it’s a good thing just to help out people if they’ve done a good track and my name can help them sell 200 more records or something, then why not? [responding to inaudible question in the audience] Yeah, give me your record, I’ll listen to it. If it’s good, maybe. If it’s shit, then it’s going to be really expensive. [laughter]

Gerd Janson

And you make it a good record?

Prins Thomas

When I used to do that, I didn’t do too many remixes in the beginning, so I took all the chances I could, like, “Anybody want a remix?” I mean, I offered my remix services to everybody.

Gerd Janson

Classics in New York, what is it? Like you talked about?

Prins Thomas

I mean, like the canon of hits. For I guess somebody who grew up going to legendary clubs, you have one specific idea of what classics are. The music they used to play in a specific time at a specific club.

Gerd Janson

But you don’t have any role models or DJs that you looked up to then? I mean, it can’t come out of nowhere, right?

Prins Thomas

No, I always had them. My first role model was a guy called DJ Strange Fruit in Norway. When I was ten-years old and he was 15 or 16, he invited me home to try his turntables.

Gerd Janson

That was a big thing then.

Prins Thomas

Yeah, he’s followed me, we still play together now and again. Like in Berlin last week, he’s sorted me out with gigs, he used to be a well-known Norwegian DJ before I started playing out. He gave me support slots.

Gerd Janson

So you paid it all back now?

Prins Thomas

Oh, yeah.

Gerd Janson

And how much can you actually enjoy DJing if you’re on the plane all the time going back and forward between Toronto and Hawaii and wherever you’re around? Isn’t all the traveling spoiling the fun?

Prins Thomas

Not really. The alternative for me has to be working as a secretary in Norwegian immigration office, so I’d rather sit on a plane now and then doing what I do.

Gerd Janson

So you don’t feel like complaining at all about what you are doing for a living?

Prins Thomas

No. I can complain and say I’m tired, but I never complain about traveling, no.

Gerd Janson

I’m just asking because it’s some kind of integral part of DJs and producers that you’re always complaining about how it should be? How you work?

Prins Thomas

No, I get the chance to read books. I’m a father of two boys, I’m married, I travel two, three weekends a month, I work in the studio more or less 9 to 5. So to me, traveling is actually a relief. It’s the only time I don’t actually have anything to attend to, I can just sit down and read a book. My idea is that I’m being paid to travel, not DJ, so it kinda makes sense for me.

Gerd Janson

Because you’re an international DJ, how would you say is the state of the club scene or dance scene worldwide?

Prins Thomas

I don’t know. I feel I’m still new to playing bigger clubs, and I think it’s exciting now because I think some of the divides between genres is getting more-or-less erased. A year ago everything you could hear in the main rooms were minimal or electro house. I don’t even know what it is, but one type of sound playing all night long. And I think it’s already getting more exciting. Different genres or different people playing in the main rooms different styles, so it’s going somewhere.

Gerd Janson

So you feel like a child in a candy store then?

Prins Thomas

In a way, to me to travel now and make a living of doing this, it’s my second chance. Like, five years ago I went bankrupt after not paying taxes in Norway and I gave up being a DJ and found a proper job, which I obviously had to.

Gerd Janson

You would have ended up in jail?

Prins Thomas

Maybe. So yeah, I’m just enjoying this.

Gerd Janson

And we haven’t talked about edits yet, right?

Prins Thomas

No, do we have to?

Gerd Janson

I think a little bit, maybe. So, you are also known for doing these things, right? So what constitutes a good edit?

Prins Thomas

I don’t know. I do a lot of edits just for personal use, and that’s the main idea. Once in a while you make something into something special, more like an accident. There’s been a couple of times where I’ve put out two edits funded by a friend, 500 copies, stuff like that. But I haven’t really released any edits. I feel there is actually no point, at least not at the moment because the market is flooded with really boring edits.

Gerd Janson

So you think it got a little out of hand, the whole edit-mania and everyone is doing one?

Prins Thomas

Yes. Everything that’s cool, everyone wants to do it so there has to be a lot of shit.

Gerd Janson

Maybe you have an edit that you like with you?

Prins Thomas

Sure, let me have a look. [searches for records]

Gerd Janson

What is an edit?

Prins Thomas

An edit is bascially when you’re reworking a track, not using the multi-tracks but...

Audience Member

Just to go in a little further, what do you mean in terms of edit?

Prins Thomas

An edit is when you’re actually doing a remix of a track but you’re only using the track itself. Not parts of the track or no additional stuff. That’s like the basics of an edit.

Gerd Janson

Like cut and paste, right?

Audience Member

Is it that you don’t like it or you didn’t finish it? Is it something that has been released and then you rework it and re-release it?

Prins Thomas

If you take a track you like, record it, and rearrange parts, then you’ve done an edit.

Gerd Janson

It’s often done with old records, right?

Prins Thomas

Yeah. A radio edit. An edit is when you rearrange things or cut out parts or whatever. I think the cool thing is that, to me, there’s no rules. You can take a shitty track with a good part and make something. In a way, what has happened, is that when a lot of people do edits, personally I think a lot of people take away the good parts in the song, or what makes the song special. But whatever works for you. I’m going to play you one of my favorite edits. It’s like an old disco track by a band called Montreal Sound, it’s called “Music Part 2.” I think I might have done some additional editing on it, so let’s see. This is proper cheese.

(music: Montreal Sound — “Music Part 2 (Prins Thomas Edit)” / applause)

To me, that’s a lot of the stuff that’s lacking in new music or new edits. Yes, it’s cheese and it’s funny and kind of raw, it’s not strict in tempo all the time, and it usually loosens up the dancefloor. Either it empties it or it loosens it up.

Gerd Janson

One should never be afraid of the cheese?

Prins Thomas

I don’t think so. I think there’s too little cheese, a lot of new stuff is too serious. Obviously, I like serious stuff, too, but you have to mix it up.

Gerd Janson

So you want to play something else for us?

Prins Thomas

I thought I could play something that probably more people have heard about.

Daft Punk — “Robot Rock”

(music: Daft Punk — “Robot Rock”)

Breakwater — “Release the Beast”

(music: Breakwater — “Release the Beast”)

And then you can do edits and basically do anything, sneak it in. I really like the original of this but it’s often hard to get people dancing to it because, yeah, this is the edit.

(music: Deep Purple — unknown edit / applause)

Suddenly you’ve got them all dancing to “Deep Purple” and I love that.

Gerd Janson

So is there actually any musical genre you dislike?

Prins Thomas

No, not a genre. I mean, there’s stuff I dislike. I’m getting older now so I’m a bit skeptical of the hip-hop made after ‘92, of course.

Gerd Janson

Ooooh.

Prins Thomas

Other than that, I'm, yeah, country, blues, jazz, techno, like, yeah.

Gerd Janson

You played that track, the Daft Punk sample. What was that again?

Prins Thomas

Breakwater. I'm not sure if it's called “Release the Beast.” I think so. Yeah.

Gerd Janson

What is your take on sampling then? Is it still something that is needed or that has to be done or today? Or do you think it's a relic of the past? In order to make music.

Prins Thomas

I mean sampling has always been there in some kind of form. I think it's a good thing. I mean this is dance music. We're not talking about composition or I think even stuff like mashups, which I personally I don't like many of them. I think the idea of doing it while you're playing, actually making something live, I like that. But even stuff like that is keeping dance music exciting and fresh. It always has to go somewhere and pick up some new ideas. Yeah. I sample stuff myself. I don't mind. I usually use my pseudonym, Major Swellings, if I do a lot of sampling, because he's a thieving bastard.

Gerd Janson

You will get sued now.

Prins Thomas

Yeah. Maybe.

Gerd Janson

Admitting it openly.

Prins Thomas

No. [laughs] First they have to pick the samples, though.

Gerd Janson

What are the legal issues related to edits? Is it the same as for a sample?

Prins Thomas

It's basically if you make a track sample something and the people who made what you sampled, if they care then it can mean trouble anyway. But the general rule is if you have a hit song, then you have trouble. If you sell a lot of copies. But not necessarily. There's been people who's bootlegged stuff and sold ten thousand copies of stuff and people still don't care. I mean, you're not going to be rich by doing it.

Gerd Janson

But it's still slightly immoral, right?

Prins Thomas

Yeah. It is. That's what's fun about it. [laughs] No, I mean I wouldn't say what's wrong or right. I've done some sampling myself and I still know I make tracks like I go into the studio and make something from scratch. Of course, it's like stealing, but it's the same as like sneaking on the bus or something. OK, society pays for it, it will get cheap. Like more expensive bus tickets because somebody's sneaking, but oh well.

Gerd Janson

What would you recommend someone who comes up to you and is like 15 years old and wants to start doing music? Just get a laptop or...?

Prins Thomas

I would probably say, get a laptop and find some free software on the internet, I don’t know.

Gerd Janson

Cheating again?

Prins Thomas

I think people should start there before they start investing in a lot of equipment.

Gerd Janson

Anymore questions?

Audience Member

[inaudible question]

Prins Thomas

I can't say.

Gerd Janson

What?

Audience Member

[inaudible question]

Prins Thomas

You know, I share a studio with Lindstrøm and he’s an equipment-obsessed guy. I only buy records. We’ve got a full studio with drums, percussion, instruments, analog synths, old organs, a lot of stuff. We record the raw material of stuff there and I edit it together on my laptop. But I’m kind of clueless, I’m trusting my ears. I really don’t know the terminology for all the stuff I do. I’m self-taught.

Gerd Janson

You’re a natural guy?

Prins Thomas

Kind of, yeah, I think so.

Gerd Janson

Any more questions for Prins Thomas? [no one in audience speaks] You intimidate them. Then, maybe we’ll listen to something that lets us slip to lunch easily.

Prins Thomas

I’ll try this.

(music: unknown)

Gerd Janson

That Steve Reich and guys like Holger Czukay and all that krautrock stuff, it's pretty important for you, as well, right? In terms of…

Prins Thomas

I think not only were they there first, but they also did some of the freshest stuff ever. Predating a lot of IDs and yet to me Holger Czukay is still up there. Unreachable. Though he's done a lot of shit, as well, though.

Gerd Janson

Like almost everyone, huh?

Prins Thomas

Yeah. Everybody has to do some shit, too. Oh, yeah. I've got this really exciting record. Some crazy Japanese techno.

(music: unknown)

That’s a large record. Escape before I put on another one, which is even crazier.

Gerd Janson

So really no more questions? Oh, another one? And another one? [audience members speaking, inaudible]

Thank you very much. That was certainly enough. Then we’re off for lunch. Thank you very much, Prins Thomas. [applause]

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