Toro Y Moi

Chaz Bundick, AKA Toro y Moi, sat down with Shawn Reynaldo for this 2012 Red Bull Music Academy Session in Phoenix. In this hour-long conversation, the Columbia, South Carolina native touched on everything from gear and touring to music journalists’ desperate attempts to describe his unique sound.

Hosted by Shawn Reynaldo Transcript:

Shawn Reynaldo

Alright, I’m not that exciting so I’ll just move right to the chase and welcome our guest for the afternoon: Chaz Bundick, AKA Toro y Moi.

[applause]

Toro y Moi

[enters]

‘Sup?

Shawn Reynaldo

All right, so I wanted to jump right into it by… Your music’s interesting and all that stuff, and we’ll get to that. But I want to ask you about your hometown because you’re from Columbia, South Carolina.

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

Which, you know, kind of like Phoenix isn’t necessarily known as being some cutting-edge cultural center or anything like that, but obviously you’ve garnered global acclaim and stuff like that, but… What was it like growing up in Columbia?

Toro y Moi

It’s a small college town, so it’s pretty dead in the summer and it’s busy during the school years. I think a lot of us growing up, the more artsy kids or whatever, the skaters, we would always hang out at you know, whatever we could really find, skateparks or coffee shops or something. There’s not much to do. Have shows and stuff, or something.

Shawn Reynaldo

Your parents aren’t from Columbia originally.

Toro y Moi

No, my mom is from the Philippines. She moved here when she was 18. Then my dad’s black. [laughs] He’s from Virginia.

Shawn Reynaldo

Did they meet in South Carolina?

Toro y Moi

No, they met in college, actually in Maryland.

Shawn Reynaldo

And then what drew them to the wilds of Columbia?

Toro y Moi

Family.

Shawn Reynaldo

OK. So you mentioned you’re a mixed racial background, was that an issue at all growing up in South Carolina? I can’t imagine there was a ton of half-black, half-Filipino kids that you could intermingle with, so…

Toro y Moi

Yeah, growing up, I guess, being biracial can be confusing at times, especially when you’re wondering what lunch table or something to sit at, but that’s about it. I don’t know, I just followed my interests.

Shawn Reynaldo

So you said you mostly fell in with the skaters, and the art kids?

Toro y Moi

Yeah. [laughs]

Shawn Reynaldo

Were those also the kids making music?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, actually our bassist Patrick, we went to high school together, we skated together, and… All the kids that sort of flocked together just ended up influencing each other and playing music because others were playing music, taking photography because others were taking photography or something, so yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

At what point did you start playing music?

Toro y Moi

I started playing piano at eight. My mom was pretty much forcing me to do that, and I really hated it. Then at 12 I told my mom I wanted to quit, but I wanted to play guitar on my own will. She let me do that.

Shawn Reynaldo

Did it go over well? Did you have to like do some extra chores or something?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I told her I would play guitar and she was like, [uncertainly] “OK,” so…

Shawn Reynaldo

Only moderately disappointed.

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

Tell me about The Heist and The Accomplice, that’s another band that you…

Toro y Moi

Yeah, that was the bassist Patrick, that was our project back in high school and college, and then once Toro y Moi took off that’s when we decided to sort of focus on this.

Shawn Reynaldo

So you started that band in high school, actually?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, it was just for fun really. We didn’t know about marketing or anything like that like nowadays, just blogs.

Shawn Reynaldo

And then when college came around you mentioned that you went to the University of South Carolina. What made you decide to stay at home?

Toro y Moi

My first year of college I went to Spartanburg, which is like an hour and a half away, because I was just tired of Columbia. I didn’t really know much about it but then the next year I moved back because I missed it so much. There’s so much more at that school in Columbia, such as facilities that I could use. Their art program was really good, it had a really good photography program, dark room and stuff, so. You know, and it’s cheaper to stay in state.

Shawn Reynaldo

Did you live at home?

Toro y Moi

I did. My freshman year I lived in the dorms, sophomore year I moved back to my house. Then I met Andy and Jordan, and we all started getting houses together and stuff.

Shawn Reynaldo

Was your mom still doing your laundry?

Toro y Moi

No, no. She knows I had to do my own chores.

Shawn Reynaldo

That’s good. At some point along the line was this also when you first met Ernest Greene [Washed Out]?

Toro y Moi

Yeah. Around my junior or senior year, maybe that summer or something. We met at a party and then we started talking about music.

Shawn Reynaldo

Could you tell everyone who that is, just in case they don’t know?

Toro y Moi

It’s AKA Washed Out.

Shawn Reynaldo

At that point were you already doing music, like Toro y Moi music?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I actually started Toro y Moi when I was in high school, my freshman year. I got like a 4-track.

Shawn Reynaldo

I read that you actually made up the name when you were like 15 years old?

Toro y Moi

Yes. Yeah, Patrick the bassist again, we had an even earlier project and I just needed a name for the stuff I was doing by myself at home.

Shawn Reynaldo

So, if you started when you were 15 and then you had this other band, why did it take so many years for releases to finally start appearing? When did it become like a proper project?

Toro y Moi

I think once the project started gaining momentum and press, it just made sense to follow that project. I wanted to do this for a living, so.

Shawn Reynaldo

Alright, well I’ll tell you what. Why don’t we listen to… I mean this is a track off the first official album. I know you had some unofficial releases before this, but the first record was called Causers of This. I’m guessing this is probably the first song that a lot of people were called and how we were introduced to you. It’s called “Blessa,” and let’s give it a listen.

Toro y Moi – “Blessa”

(music: Toro y Moi – “Blessa” / applause)

So, that was the first track of Causers of This. I just want to ask you about the process of making that album, because before you were in a band format with The Heist and The Accomplice, and this you pretty much made on your own.

Toro y Moi

Yeah. I guess it started in college when I got a laptop for school. Then I ended up getting Fruity Loops and then I moved on to Reason. I got more into sampling and electronic music, and for some reason it clicked all of a sudden once I knew how to create that style of music, create electronic music. I was drawn to all types of electronic music. I guess that’s what I was channeling through Causers, was a lot of house and R&B, hip-hop.

Shawn Reynaldo

Is that stuff that you grew up listening to?

Toro y Moi

Not so much. I started listening to more R&B once I got into high school and college.

Shawn Reynaldo

What kind of hip-hop and R&B?

Toro y Moi

I don’t even know, Michael Jackson to A Tribe Called Quest. Not too much, really. I listen to more now. Growing up I was really into Weezer and The Pixies and stuff.

Shawn Reynaldo

I also in my research saw that you liked Blink 182 a lot?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, when I was in high school.

Shawn Reynaldo

Do you try and keep that on the DL now? Am I totally blowing up your spot?

Toro y Moi

No, I’m not really ashamed of anything I listen to. I like it all. I like Justin Bieber and Taylor Swift too, because my girlfriend listens to it a lot, so it reminds me of her. [laughs]

Shawn Reynaldo

At what point did you start hearing the word “Chillwave,” and how did you feel about it?

Toro y Moi

I heard it 2009 when, I guess, a lot of artists at the time were doing stuff out of their bedroom and they’re also one-guy projects, all these similarities. I just thought, “Whatever, I don’t know what they’re talking about, but…”

Shawn Reynaldo

So if you had to rank these terms from favorite to least favorite, “Chillwave,” “Glo-fi,” and “Hypnagogic pop,” which one’s the worst?

Toro y Moi

OK, that’s a given. It’s probably the last one you said. The last one I don’t know how to say. Then it would probably be chillwave, and then glo-fi sounds the most pleasant to say.

Shawn Reynaldo

When you started hearing people lumping you in with these terms, did you feel a need to run away from it?

Toro y Moi

Not at all, no. I’m constantly changing my music even before I was releasing stuff officially. My friends know that I was doing electronic stuff and then going to do an acoustic album, sort of Elliott Smith-esque or something. I don’t know. I get bored easily, and so even when I was recording this album I was playing or recording stuff that was for Underneath the Pine. Then once I had enough material and I felt comfortable, I grouped those together and released it.

Shawn Reynaldo

At some point, I assume once Causers of This came out and got a lot of positive attention, I’m sure you had to start playing a lot more shows.

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

And were you already playing live as Toro y Moi before the album came out really?

Toro y Moi

I played maybe five shows before that as Toro y Moi. Yeah, I just started playing more once the tours were booked.

Shawn Reynaldo

And, those initial shows and even when you first started touring, was it just you?

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

And was it weirdly nerve-wrecking to go out on stage? Were you going out with like a laptop, and…?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, that’s the only thing I could think of doing that would let people know what I was making. I couldn’t go out and do that with a guitar or something. And some artists can, I mean… Some artists pull off the one-man show really well, and it’s amazing to see, and it’s very strong and powerful, but I felt uncomfortable and totally out of my element so the band was the first step I wanted to do.

Shawn Reynaldo

How many shows or at what point did you actually start bringing in other performers for the live show?

Toro y Moi

We started talking about touring together maybe after the first tour I did in like, August 2009. So we got ready for tour with Caribou, we were supporting them, and we were a three-piece. After that we were a four-piece.

Shawn Reynaldo

All right, I want to play another song from Causers of This and then we’ll move on to a later thing. I feel like this has become maybe the most popular track off the record. It’s called, is it “Talamak”?

Toro y Moi:

The official pronunciation is “Toh-lah-mik.”

Shawn Reynaldo

What is it a reference to?

Toro y Moi

 It’s Tagalog for “Chronic” or “Chronicle.”

Shawn Reynaldo

All right, so let’s check it out.

Toro y Moi – Talamak

(music: Toro y Moi – “Talamak”)

[applause]

So, when you were taking songs like that and then putting them into the context of a band, did you have to kind of like dissect the songs and then put them back together?

Toro y Moi

Yeah. As you can tell probably, that song relies a lot on the production. The production is what gives it that mood. Really, the only thing left to do in the live setting is to bring out the songwriting, which is what we did, and I think it works well. There’s only a few songs on the album that really can’t be pulled off with a band, just because it’s cheesy or it doesn’t work.

Shawn Reynaldo

When you’re playing live, I mean listening to that song, there’s a lot of sort of weird shuffly sounds where it almost sounds like you’re reversing it and stuff. How do you translate that live, because you can’t reverse your own voice necessarily?

Toro y Moi

Right, yeah. There’s only so much you can do. We have samplers on stage and effects pedals… Then our front of house guy, Pat, he’s doing stuff too with his laptop up front. Yeah, it can’t really be replicated, but we try. [laughs]

Shawn Reynaldo

Do you no longer have a laptop onstage when you’re performing?

Toro y Moi

We do, but it’s like sort of behind the scenes. It’s not an instrument or anything.

Shawn Reynaldo

Yeah, it’s not like you’re just staring at your Mac the whole time.

Toro y Moi

Right, yeah. [laughs]

Shawn Reynaldo

How did this affect the songwriting process, both playing live with a band and also touring, I assume a lot?

Toro y Moi

I guess when I made Underneath the Pine I was really thinking about the live show. I wanted to create an album that was going to work really well live, and so the best thing to do for that is to use live instruments. I tracked the whole thing at my parents’ house, actually. That was after I graduated, I think. Yeah, it was after I graduated and I still didn’t know what to do, so I took to the studio and mixed it.

Shawn Reynaldo

I saw that in a previous interview where you said that halfway through the process, or maybe it was after you had made it, you basically scrapped half of Underneath the Pine and then went back and redid it. What prompted you to do that?

Toro y Moi

You know, I really wasn’t… I guess once you start to get you know, noticed and I guess, to a certain status, you start wondering about fans and gaining fans, and stuff like that. Then the material that I recorded before that was very folky and anti-folky, and just a mix of things that I’ve done before and I was used to, so I thought that the best thing to do to bond my two different styles was to find some sort of segue or some genre that would work best. I found that funk and disco worked as that medium.

Shawn Reynaldo

All right, why don’t we hear something off the final product and then we can talk more about the process of making the record. This is called “Still Sound,” and this is from the second album, Underneath the Pine.

Toro y Moi – “Still Sound”

(music: Toro y Moi – “Still Sound”)

[applause]

Toro y Moi

Thank you.

Shawn Reynaldo

So, writing a song like that, it was still all you pretty much in your bedroom, right?

Toro y Moi

Yeah. I had moved all my equipment actually to my parents’ piano room, so yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

It sounds like a lot more full and real, and that’s because…

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

Is everything on there? How much of that is real instruments as opposed to…?

Toro y Moi

Oh, it’s 100%. There’s a kick drum in the background that’s looped over and over again, but that’s about it.

Shawn Reynaldo

When you were making Underneath the Pine, did you feel… I mean, you mentioned that you were thinking about your fans and how you’re perceived; now that Toro y Moi was like an established thing, did you feel a pressure making it that it had to be a real album now?

Toro y Moi

Yeah. I mean you start thinking about how long is this going to last, and how big are you trying to get, and then you start thinking about all of these factors that start messing with your head. I don’t know. And then you just have to trust your gut and just still try to remain adventurous and open-minded to everything, but then again, everything’s on the other side trying to tell you not to change and stuff. I don’t know. It’s a weird, fun process. [laughs]

Shawn Reynaldo

Did you find it constructive then? Were you like checking the blogs and being like, “Oh, what are they saying about me?”

Toro y Moi

[laughs] Like doing market research? No.

Shawn Reynaldo

Yeah, or were you trying to shut that… I mean it sounds like you weren’t necessarily shutting it all out?

Toro y Moi

Right. I mean at the same time you can’t just be totally oblivious to what’s going on in the music world. I always do that whenever I start making a new album, even when I started working on the next album. Every time I start or when I say like, “OK, this is it,” I start an iTunes playlist, call it “Album Three,” and have like MP3s of all sorts of stuff, from old ‘70s stuff to some of the newest production techniques that I like.

Shawn Reynaldo

So for Underneath the Pine, what would you say, in terms of influences then and things that you were drawing from, how was it different from your previous releases?

Toro y Moi

The influences? I mean for Causers I was really into sampling and incorporating the whole shoegaze element to that. Then, like I was saying, I was looking for that segue. So for Underneath the Pine I was influenced by what I was sampling, which was soundtracks, and funk, and R&B and disco.

Shawn Reynaldo

When you would see yourself being compared and lumped in with other artists under the “Chillwave” umbrella or whatever it was, you don’t have to name names, but would you ever see other artists and be like, “I don’t sound anything like that guy”?

Toro y Moi

Of course, yeah. I mean, no one thinks that they sound like anyone, but people will find similarities.

Shawn Reynaldo

But then again, Washed Out is someone that you’re friends with as well.

Toro y Moi

Right, yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

I feel like there is a similarity there.

Toro y Moi:

I totally agree, yeah. I mean we influenced each other and taught each other things before this whole thing picked up, so I could totally understand that.

Shawn Reynaldo

And then, so, after Underneath the Pine came out, pretty quickly thereafter you put out another substantial release, the Freaking Out EP.

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

What prompted you to... You know what, why don’t we play something off it, and then I want to ask you about it. I think this is the first track, “All Alone.”

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

All right, this is the first track off the Freaking Out EP.

Toro y Moi – “All Alone”

(music: Toro y Moi – “All Alone”)

[applause]

So, what prompted you to put out another pretty substantial EP so quickly after Underneath the Pine?

Toro y Moi

The main reason was I wanted to play more upbeat songs live. Yeah, on Underneath the Pine there’s a handful of songs that are actually danceable, as opposed to just a moderate tempo. It’s that or it’s instrumental. So, yeah, we wanted to play more funky and upbeat and get people moving live. Again, the live show influences how I’m writing, which is weird.

Shawn Reynaldo

Obviously, you’re pulling from a lot of retro sounds on there. There’s definitely disco elements, a lot of the ‘80s boogie, R&B, funk kind of stuff going on, even some Daft Punk French house things going on. How do you revisit these retro styles without sounding derivative, or just becoming like a nostalgia act?

Toro y Moi

Right. When I go back to my playlists for all the albums and stuff I even change the title on them and write down what I like about a certain track. Sometimes the sample influences how the... You know, that song started with that floor-tom snap sample, so the whole song was based off of that and that sort of just took its way. And I think that’s not even a disco song, that was like a kraut song or something.

Shawn Reynaldo

Are most of your sample things, or even just if you’re listening to records that you like, do you tend to pull from really obscure sources or do you listen to a lot of more mainstream stuff from those eras as well?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I think the fun part about sampling is puzzling people and seeing if they can figure out what it is. It’s always fun to get the weirdest, most obscure samples, even if it’s just the four-on-the-floor beat.

Shawn Reynaldo

Do you ever get like über-fans being like, “I know that snare sound is...,” you know, fill in the blank?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I think a couple people called me out from Causers. They were like, “That’s like a Reason preset.” “Yeah. [laughs] Whoops.” [laughter] Now I’m trying to avoid that, and that’s just the fun part.

Shawn Reynaldo

Were the songs on Freaking Out, were those written then after Underneath the Pine or were they from the same sessions?

Toro y Moi

No, that’s all after_ Underneath the Pine_.

Shawn Reynaldo

Because I think Freaking Out came out like six months, or not even, after.

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I wrote it in February 2011. That was right when Underneath the Pine was coming out.

Shawn Reynaldo

You mentioned that you wanted it to be more dance-y and upbeat, and you also have another project, like a side project. Is it Les Sins, is that how you say it?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I call it “Lessons” but it’s a play on words, so you can say it whichever way.

Shawn Reynaldo

I mean you get to decide, it’s your project.

Toro y Moi

Yeah. Les Sins is probably the most PC way to say it, but I had the word “Lessons” in mind.

Shawn Reynaldo

What prompted you to have a whole other side project?

Toro y Moi

I think that having multiple names and projects is probably the most fun things you can ever do as a musician, and just, again, puzzle people. The whole fact that you can be anonymous is a fun thing, so that was one reason I wanted to do that again or start another project. And another reason was that I didn’t want people to think that Toro y Moi was like a DJ or just dance music, so I created a project that was just dance music. [laughs]

Shawn Reynaldo

Why don’t we hear one of the songs? There’s only the one 12", is that the only official release?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, so far.

Shawn Reynaldo

So this is the A side of a 12" that came out, and it’s called “Lina.”

Les Sins – “Lina”

(music: Les Sins – “Lina”)

[applause]

Do you really like Daft Punk a lot?

Toro y Moi

They’re all right. [laughs] Yeah, I love them.

Shawn Reynaldo

I mean, there’s definitely a lot of that sort of French touch, French house sound in there. It reminds me a lot of their Discovery album.

Toro y Moi

Right, yeah, I was listening to that a lot at that time. That’s when I first discovered electronic and house music, so that’s what was being channeled through that.

Shawn Reynaldo

When you’re making these songs, is this something that you go back to your laptop and are doing all digitally, or is there organic elements in there as well?

Toro y Moi

You know, that’s one of the first experiments I did, and so that’s all on the computer. There’s some MIDI stuff in there, I’m playing the keys. I think now that I’m more comfortable and I feel like I’m more skilled and educated on the rights and wrongs of certain things, whether it’s production techniques or even songwriting stuff, there’s things I’m willing to try.

Shawn Reynaldo

Is there going to be more releases under this name, do you think, or was it just a one-off?

Toro y Moi

I want to do more. It’s fun. Yeah, I want to start DJing and I want to start playing my tracks out, and... Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

Have you done any proper club DJing or beat matching?

Toro y Moi

I’ve done a few, yeah. On tour there’s afterparties or something that we’ll DJ. Sometimes it’s just me, sometimes it’s all of us, we do like a night of it. I think that whole environment is completely different, and that’s what I love about having that side project.

Shawn Reynaldo

Yeah, I was going to ask, how big of a role would you say that electronic music of this style, more club-oriented, house, whatever; how big of a role does that play in your life? Is it something you follow obsessively or is it just kind of whatever comes along?

Toro y Moi

I’ve sort of become obsessed with it. Before I was just sort of into what people were talking about, but now I’m checking the blogs all the time and even reading the ones that aren’t in English and stuff just to see what I can find. Yeah, I’m about as into it as I think I could be.

Shawn Reynaldo

Do you buy records or any of that stuff?

Toro y Moi

I don’t buy vinyl house music or anything. I like singles, because I’m not really DJing or I don’t even have a setup. I think the only vinyl I buy are maybe reissues or something.

Shawn Reynaldo

What scenes, and this could be current or it could be from the past, what pockets of electronic music, or dance music if you want to call it [that], would you say are most interesting to you?

Toro y Moi

Probably deep house and French house. I think a lot of the new stuff, I’ve been playing with space and so, just sort of trying to mimic those elements of space that I hear in deep house.

Shawn Reynaldo

Then when you go back, because you’re still doing Toro y Moi the whole time, and that’s like a band and it’s pretty much all instruments, do you ever go back to that setup and be like, “Oh, this is boring, I don’t want to make a pop song”? [laughs]

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I mean that’s when I’ll go and do something else like just play with my loop pedal or something. Or sometimes I don’t even mess with music. If you’re not feeling creative in that field, just go away from it. I’ll go mess with my photos or something in Photoshop, start working on a design for something. I think for Underneath the Pine, when I threw away all that old, the first material I had, there were a couple weeks in between where I just didn’t do anything. I tried to go back out and socialize, but when I got back into the groove I didn’t even talk to anyone really, or go out. I don’t really go out when I’m working on music, like, when I’m in the album mode.

Shawn Reynaldo

It seems like when you started Toro y Moi, and even when the first album came out and stuff, you seemed to mention that it just kind of happened, and then all of a sudden you were playing all these shows and stuff. At this point do you think of yourself as like, “I’m a musician, this is what I do, this is my career”?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, I’m making a living off of it and it’s really awesome. I’m really thankful for it. It’s really cool that it’s happening.

Shawn Reynaldo

I want to ask you about the realities of being a, quote, indie artist in 2012. As far as that scene goes, I mean you’re the kind of artist you get written up; anything you do, it’s news on Pitchfork.

Toro y Moi

Right.

Shawn Reynaldo

Or you’re doing tours all over the world, really. But I imagine like you’re probably not going to sell a million records or anything like that.

Toro y Moi

Right, yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

Is it really financially sustainable to be an indie act in 2012?

Toro y Moi

It can be. When I first started playing shows I was solo for the first two tours, and that’s when you can be on the road for a month making $100 a night. [points at audience member] This guy knows. He brought me since 2009 to Phoenix and now here we are. When I was solo I was playing for 100 bucks a night. I was paying for gas. I was just driving by myself in my Ford Focus. I would invite friends along to help me drive, just because it can get ridiculously tiring. Then, when we got to that move when we were getting paid more, coincidentally I was ready to make that move to have a band. We’ve been fortunate enough to have really awesome timing.

Shawn Reynaldo

How much touring is involved in your life these days?

Toro y Moi

I’d say maybe eight months, seven months out of the year. It’s pretty rough.

Shawn Reynaldo

Do you enjoy it, or is it just like something you’ve got to do?

Toro y Moi

It’s bittersweet. Yeah, it’s something you’ve got to do, and you don’t want to go back to working at the bagel shop or anything like that. That’s what I was doing. You have to make ends meet and you have to pay the bills, and so touring is fun and not fun. Because you get to see the world and you get to see all these amazing exotic places, but you’re only there for maybe ten hours. I think the first time we were in Italy we were there for eight hours. I mean, it’s bittersweet, but you do get to see where you want to go back to, so.

Shawn Reynaldo

Now when you go and talk to your mom about your music, is she OK with you not playing piano anymore?

Toro y Moi

Well, yeah, she sees I’m playing piano, but…

Shawn Reynaldo

Like with your parents, I’m curious, are they like, “Oh, this is our son, he’s a musician,” or are they still waiting for you to like get a real job?

Toro y Moi

No, no, they are very into... My mom has me on her Google Reader, so she tells me every time I’m on Pitchfork or something. I’m like, “Yeah, I know, I saw it too.”

Shawn Reynaldo

Is she getting on message boards like when there’s a bad review and like…

Toro y Moi

I think the first time I told her I was on Pitchfork she didn’t really know, but she was super excited that I was in the Columbia Free Times weekly. [laughs] I can still see that jump of what older people know about, the big media circuits. You know?

Shawn Reynaldo

Yeah. So I also want to ask you about when you started making music as Toro y Moi it was pretty much just you in your bedroom and stuff like that. But as it gets bigger and it progresses, how has your process evolved in terms of your gear that you’re using? Are you using an elaborate setup, are you recording in real studios now? How much is it like a real, quote, band?

Toro y Moi

We practice just like any other band, and it sucks sometimes because you have to play it 20 times in a day when you’re learning a new song. Sometimes you have off-days and everyone’s messing up on stage, or you’re having power issues. Then again, everyone’s playing an important role so it’s very much a band.

Shawn Reynaldo

But you’re still writing all of the material, yes?

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

Do you think at some point you might invite other people into the songwriting process?

Toro y Moi

Totally, yeah. I think eventually, even maybe this album... It makes sense to do that. I think it worked so well for a band, you know Cloud Nothings? He did his first full band album, and it sounds amazing. His sound totally changed but I felt like it was for the best. You never know what is going to help.

Shawn Reynaldo

How do you walk that line where it’s your project but there’s a band? You’re technically the boss and kind of have to steer the ship so to speak, but I assume these guys are you friends.

Toro y Moi

Right. Yeah, we’ve been childhood friends, so it’s weird.

Shawn Reynaldo

Do you have to ever be like, “Hey, that bassline sucks”?

Toro y Moi

[laughs] No. My band, they’re all talented guys, so they can pick up on it right away. I might have to tell them, “Maybe turn down the distortion a little bit,” or maybe, “Use eighth notes or something.” It’s not a democracy or anything, so... [laughter] Or it’s not a… What’s the other one? I’m not the king, that one.

Shawn Reynaldo

Freudian slip?

Toro y Moi

Yeah. Whoops.

[laughter]

Shawn Reynaldo

No, but I’m curious about how much of stuff is up for a vote so to speak?

Toro y Moi

You know, the band votes on it. If Patrick’s using too much fuzz bass or Ewan’s using a little bit too much wah pedal, we might be like, “Yo, chill it out. Chill out the…” [laughs] There’s been times where we’ll have to take a break because we’re arguing so much over something, but it’s all for the best, so yeah.

Shawn Reynaldo

So you don’t get veto power just because it’s like your band?

Toro y Moi

I do. If I am just like, “No, I don’t want to play that song today,” then that fortunately that can be my call, because I have to sing it and I don’t want to sing it today or something. I try to make everything equal. I’m not a control freak.

Shawn Reynaldo

You just seem like a total tyrant, like a total power maniac.

Toro y Moi

Yeah, it’s a weird situation. [laughs]

Shawn Reynaldo

What are you guys doing right now? Is there another album in the works?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, there is. This is actually the first album where I’m going to just take my time and not have to set a deadline, and write in between now and that deadline. I’ve been going to the studio already, and I’m doing it in the studio, of course. It’s a new environment to be there. I don’t know exactly what I’m into yet. Yeah, it’s coming along.

Shawn Reynaldo

Where do you see it going stylistically? Do you think it’s going to continue on the dancier vibe of Freaking Out?

Toro y Moi

You know I’ve always wanted to keep people that are already fans interested in what I’m going to do next, so it’s gonna be very... I think if you liked the first two albums you’re going to like this one, so. Then again, I’m always trying to gain new ears as well.

Shawn Reynaldo

OK, cool. Why don’t we open it up to the audience and see if anyone out here has any questions for Chaz? I guess you can just raise your hand.

Audience Member

What’s up, man? How you doing? I have a question. How important is side-chaining in your music when you’re using electronic stuff?

Toro y Moi

I wouldn’t say it’s very important. That’s something that I messed around with for the first album and then I wanted to just leave it alone, I don’t know for how long but it’s not important at all to me. I don’t know, that was just mainly an experiment for Causers.

Audience Member

Yeah, for that first one?

Toro y Moi

Yeah.

Audience Member

OK, cool.

Audience Member

What’s up, man?

Toro y Moi

What’s up, dude?

Audience Member

I was curious, are you a big fan of psychedelic music?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, totally.

Audience Member

I hear a lot of that in all the music, across the board. I was also wondering what blogs do you like to check out music and stuff?

Toro y Moi

I wish I had my computer with me onstage. I’ve really been looking at a lot of YouTube channels, really, because a lot of the blogs you can’t even download them anymore just because people are scared of posting MP3s. There’s a lot of YouTube channels that I can’t even pronounce because people just make up weird screen names, but... Bleep is good for electronic music. I don’t really know too many psychedelic blogs or anything though.

Audience Member

Psychedelic Heroin is one I would recommend.

Toro y Moi

What was that?

Audience Member

Psychedelic Heroin is one that I would recommend, yeah.

Toro y Moi

OK.

Audience Member

Captaincrawl.com is awesome too.

Toro y Moi

Captain Crawl, thanks.

Audience Member

How you doing?

Toro y Moi

How’s it going?

Audience Member

My question is related to when you started performing by yourself, just with a laptop.

Toro y Moi

Right.

Audience Member

‘Cause you’re singing songs, right?

Toro y Moi

Uh-huh. [affirmative]

Audience Member

Would you primarily focus on those songs that you were singing and would you only be singing? How much would you extract from the instrumental to perform?

Toro y Moi

Right. I would take out all the keys, and I was playing the keys live and just singing on top. I think that was the only thing I felt like was working. I wasn’t really into dancing, or like interacting with the crowd or anything until recently.

Shawn Reynaldo

Well I wanna ask you, actually that brings up a point where... How important are lyrics in your music? Because you’ve mentioned that you’re getting more into dance stuff, and that’s a world where lyrics and words don’t necessarily matter. Your songs are also very pop, and the vocals are in the forefront, so...

Toro y Moi

Right. Lately I’ve been trying to focus more on lyrics just because they are coming more towards the front and I don’t want them to be so mundane. I don’t know. I feel like a lot of the lyrics from the first records, I wasn’t trying to write poetic or anything, I was just writing, and not trying to avoid reiteration or anything like that. So then I think few people ended up liking it the way it was, so I don’t know. I try not to change my technique too much because it works.

Shawn Reynaldo

Are your lyrics usually pretty literal? Are your songs about certain people and certain things?

Toro y Moi

Right. Yeah, I like that. I have a lot of songs that are like that, but then I enjoy songs that are just straight up weird and you don’t know what they’re talking about. Or they’re about some sort of character, you know. I really like the Frank Ocean’s song “Novacane,” and how he talks about just meeting this girl at Coachella and just doing drugs. I thought it was a really cool concept, and I’ve never thought about lyrics like that. That’s one of the inspirations or one of the songs on my playlist for this album.

Shawn Reynaldo

Anyone else in the audience?

Audience Member

So what’s on that iTunes playlist for the new album? What’s in there?

Toro y Moi

You know, it’s weird because stuff because I have some movie soundtrack stuff, but I’m focusing more on the chords that they use and not really the production. I feel like a lot of the ‘70s stuff that was on the playlist for Underneath the Pine was more for the production, but this is more for the songwriting. That, and there’s some Kanye West on there. I really liked Watch the Throne. I thought that was really pushing mainstream hip-hop boundaries.

Audience Member

When you’re in album mode do you find yourself listening randomly to music differently, or does it just pop in your head, “This would be good for the [album]”?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, again I guess I just listen to it for different elements. I’ll have a Flying Lotus song in there for like texture, just because I liked the way he was using his space, the way he sometimes doesn’t have any space and everything is just sown together. Again, I guess I just listen for different things from different songs.

Shawn Reynaldo

What kind of stuff are you listening to when it’s not like listening for chords or listening for instruments, when you’re just like, “I want to listen to something that I like.”

Toro y Moi

It’s probably going to be the newest song I just wrote. [smiles] I’m sure other producers out there do this too, songwriters, you’re probably constantly listening to your stuff. If not, I guess that’s fine. I’m constantly critiquing myself and seeing what needs to change, and what I would want to do. Seriously, I’ve woken up with headaches just because I’ve been listening to my headphones way too loud and just listening to the newest song that I’ve made or something. It’s been a while since I’ve just listened to someone else’s music and just sort of just soaked it in because the mood it put me in...

Shawn Reynaldo

Does that mean from the time that you first record a song to when it goes on the album, does your average song go through like 74 different versions?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, by the time the album comes out I’m probably tired of the song. [laughs] That’s why I’m writing a new song or a new album already. Yeah, I don’t know. Getting to this position to where it’s your job, you sort of look at music and hear music differently. I used to listen to my music, and it’s probably bad, but I used to listen to my music to sort of put me in that mood, and now I feel like that’s sort of going away. That’s more just like checking my homework sort of now.

Shawn Reynaldo

Are you still enjoying it as much?

Toro y Moi

Oh I love it, yeah. I mean, it’s bittersweet. I love doing it, and I love making new songs all the time, and I’m always collaborating with people, and just making little MP3s and just showing them to friends only, so yeah, it’s definitely a passion. I want to make sure I don’t get jaded doing this. If I’m ever feeling like this is just becoming work or something is forced, I’m going to go back to doing something else.

Shawn Reynaldo

Bagel shop? Will they take you back?

Toro y Moi

No. Hopefully some design thing.

Shawn Reynaldo

Is there another question in the audience?

Audience Member

Yeah. Hi, how you doing?

Toro y Moi

What’s going on?

Audience Member

For your writing process, how much do you rely on music theory and standard chordal progressions and stuff?

Toro y Moi

I guess, I was classically trained, when I was eight up until like 12, so I had forgot already how to sightread. If you show me something I’ll have to figure it out for 20 minutes. But you know, I like my songs... Let me start over. I understand all of the music theory, and I like to incorporate that when it comes to having dynamics and knowing when to go to cut time or something. That’s just sort of become part of the production as well. I find the songwriter is now the producer as well. That’s sort of a blurry line now.

Shawn Reynaldo

I assume a lot of your production techniques are self-taught as well. Are you still kind of just like piecemealing it together, like how to use programs and stuff like that?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, and being in a studio now too working on this, I never really messed with ProTools, so I’m learning my way around that. I’ve always been a fan of hardware, so just the feel of knobs and actually hearing what you’re changing is very gratifying. Yeah, I’m constantly learning new stuff, staying up late on YouTube watching videos on pedals, and... I don’t know.

Shawn Reynaldo

Does anyone else in the audience have any questions? There you go.

Audience Member

I’d like to ask you two questions.

Toro y Moi

OK.

Audience Member

First, are you an only child?

Toro y Moi

No, I have a brother.

Audience Member

A brother? Is he older?

Toro y Moi

Yeah, he’s 19.

Audience Member

OK, younger. Who is your favorite Beatle?

Toro y Moi

My favorite Beatle?

Audience Member

If you could compare yourself, if you wanted to choose a Beatle to sort of model your career after or not model your career after.

Toro y Moi

I like George [Harrison]. George is cool.

Audience Member

Sweet.

Shawn Reynaldo

Why?

Toro y Moi

Why? Because George is the one that changed the Beatles, I feel like. He brought in the Hare Krishna. But I think Paul is my favorite songwriter.

Shawn Reynaldo

Anyone else in the audience have any questions? All right, well of course Chaz is going to be performing with the full band later tonight right here, so everyone can come back, but let’s thank him for coming out and sitting on the couch.

[applause]

Toro y Moi

Thank you.

Shawn Reynaldo

Toro y Moi!

Toro y Moi

Thank you. Peace out.

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